Where's the beef?


Sarah Darkmagic - Posted on 03 January 2011

Lately, I've heard a number of rumblings on Twitter and other places about the lack of this or that D&D content. This morning we had a discussion about the lack of concrete content in blogs and podcasts, how most of it consists of generalities and wishy-washy suggestions. I agree that this problem exists and, to be honest, I see it as a long term problem. Related to this lack of specifics is a general lack of debate. As a group, we are often afraid to create "in your face" controversy. Here are some of the problems I see with changing things and ideas for how we might improve.

Different meanings to different people

Creating content with some real meat to it is often difficult. For instance, my experience tells me that I need to sculpt encounters to appeal to my players and their characters' abilities. I've played with my guys long enough to know what that means for them. However, I have no idea what your group is like. With the number of play styles, group interactions, etc, coming up with actual tips is pretty difficult and quickly become niche. The problem with niche is that it only applies to a small number of people and the return on investment is very small. In the end, I think we just have to embrace niche, but it's scary to do, especially when people then complain that what I just spent my life energy on doesn't appeal to them and is useless.

Difficult to create

In addition, podcasts have the added hurdle of two distinct audiences. One audience wants to listen to it in the background. They don't want to have to pay attention. But the type of information we need to convey requires a much more active audience. To add to the pain, presentations without visuals are difficult for a fair number of people. Have you tried listening to a football game on the radio? At the end of the day, I know I don't know how to provide information in this format in an efficient manner. I'm willing to learn, but it will take me awhile.

Debate needed

We need to debate things. Through debate we often get to the crux of the issues. It requires us to spend resources and proves to ourselves and others what ideas we really care about. My posts on dungeons created some awesome and heart-felt responses. What's important to remember is being anti for the sake of it can easily backfire. But if you have an issue with something, open your mouth. Write an email to a the site (especially if it's not a personal blog) to see if they would be willing to post your rebuttal.

Participation society

Like open source, the D&D blog/podcast community is based on who participates. I produce content, some people seem to like it, and my role in the community increases. That is awesome because it lowers the barrier to entry. On the other hand, it doesn't mean that the people who rise to the top are the best at what they do or have the tools to provide everything to everyone. Don't like what you see? Create something you love. Talk to the people in the community you like about working on your dream project.

Opportunities abound

I mentioned niche earlier. One nice thing about blogs in particular is that they don't have the overhead of other forms of publication. Printed material needs to be, well, printed. Audio podcasts need to be edited. However, both blogs and podcasts have a low cost of distribution. This makes them great for niche. All it takes is time and love.

Anyway, that's how I see things. I have one wish for 2011 and that's people get out there create, tear down and talk about it all with passion and respect.

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Regarding debate: agreed, a lively debate between two folks with differing opinions can certainly be entertaining and informative; however, more often than not, the crux of the issue comes down to personal preferences.

And since we're talking about a past-time, that means were debating the merit of how people choose to enjoy their leisure time. Not to say that can't result in an interesting conversation, though, as it often does.

You're opening quite a can of worms with debate. Having grass roots political experience, and having a socio-political blog of my own, I have little faith in the average American's ability to engage in reasonable, polite debate. If you think that doesn't apply to gaming because it's "just a game," just search for "edition wars" on your search engine of choice. :-)

Awww, but the Dungeon debate went so well. :)

Some people seem to want debate. I've seen it go really well and really poorly. It all comes down to who the participants are and how much people care to moderate.

At least with regards to podcasts, I disagree. On blogs, certainly, the "anonymity" of blog posts and especially blog responses can get ugly.

But when you're actually talking to someone one-on-one on the phone, through skype or in person on microphones, most people (certainly not all) tend to be more respectful of each other.

We have many disagreements between the hosts of our show -- as we each approach the hobby differently. None of these arguments have become fights. Sometimes we get a bit passionate, and I'll sometimes step in to moderate the discussion, but we've never had a discussion turn ugly. Ever.

The internet (as we all know) is rife with some very active (and bored) trolls, and I can see how a political blog would have a huge problem with them. But even our forum, which has been up for 18 months and is fairly active, has NEVER had a flame war. I've never had to moderate it, and the only posts I've deleted are spambots.

One of our ground rules for the show is that we DON'T talk politics. We focus on gaming (and beer).

And the fact is, being confronted by another host (or listener) with differing opinions (and a different approach to the game), can increase our gaming toolkit. If you're a GM and play in a game with a GM with a vastly different playing style, you'll see techniques that will help you run a better game.

We all want to improve our game, and playing with (or observing or talking to) folks who take a different approach to the hobby can only help.

As for content with meat, I believe a lot of bloggers are "saving" their best work for "future" publication. Using your example of encounters, why should I post an encounter I spent hours working on up on my blog for free, if there is a chance I can get paid for it from a publication? And if I were to try and get it published and it is rejected then it must stink so, why should I post something on my blog that stinks? Or at least that is how some minds run.

As for content to spark debate, my ego is fragile and I could not stand the nasty comments that will be made, after all have you seen the "feedback" on forums? OK, my ego isn't fragile, but some people can not take harsh criticism so avoid debate completely. For some, blogs are ways to express themselves while minimizing/removing the chance of being ridiculed in a forum setting.

Last callin's post:2E - 4E Dark Sun

Add on top of it the fact that some places won't publish content if it's been previously published, including on a blog, and things get even worse. And, if you want to pitch, that ties up the content for some period of time, 60 days at least in terms of DDI articles. I think it's important for people to realize a ding from something like Dungeon/Dragon and even Kobold Quarterly doesn't always mean the content stinks. It may mean the editor doesn't think it will appeal to their broad audiences.

I've gotten some less than kind responses on my own articles, so I understand the fear. Fortunately, I'm not that fragile. The nice thing about blogging is that I don't have to see what they say about me in the forums :)

I have been accused of being able to argue with an empty chair. There is some truth in that. I have always believed that you learn so much more in thoughtful debates between people who disagree(on a friendly level) than people who will reiterate what you already believe or see. I have not always found the best venue for such a debate, but if one appears, I am always willing to be the voice of dissent or davils advocate. Just saying.

I happen to love to debate, but some people take debate the wrong way. One of the best discussions I ever witnessed was a very heated, but friendly debate on education policy. Afterwards, everyone was all smiles and went to dinner together. Awesome stuff when it can happen.

Create something you love.

Challenge Accepted.

Last Matt Savage's post:ConflictAddict: *poke*

So, are you talking specifically about content RE:WotC or just D&D bloggers?

Well, WotC seems to have spent their creative muscle on game mechanics, not fluff. I play and love 4e and respect the changes they have made, their dedication to change, if you will. But OtoH, they have not spent much time on the fluff, which is really what excites the community and gives you bloggers something to do.

I hope that the Nentir vale stuff turns out OK, but that setting will never equal the creative energy that Dark Sun, and Eberron (or even hoary old Forgotten Realms) brought to game when they were NEW. The community does not need another retread or milquetoast world.

It needs something new and compelling. In short its about inspiration. Pathfinder's mechanics leave me cold, but those folks are inspired about their game.

If there is an exception to my point it would be Gamma World. Even though it was a retread, was inspired. Unfortunately, there seems to be no support via DDI, other than previews. A damn shame.

Part of what inspired this post was a discussion that the D&D bloggers didn't have enough disagreement and debate, that it was all one big echo chamber or something.

I used to be guilty of what Callin was saying, but honestly just putting my stuff out there instead of tossing it into the black hole of submissions and overly fretting about it, has completely re-energized my creative juices. It's true what they say - don't horde ideas, the more you give them out freely the more you'll have.

As for polite debate, I've found that generally (though not always), debate on blog sites tends to be a bit more polite than on forums, since on a blog you're a 'guest' in someone elses 'house'. Personally, I know I never really trust my judgment on something until I've had to defend that point of view.

BTW thank-you for reminding me of the best 80s commercial ever!

Last Victor Von Dave's post:The Scarlet Citadel – Part Two

You're welcome. I like how it works on two levels in this discussion too :)

I am having fun filling out my tiny niche.
As I am not likely to be paid for my output,
I am at least sharing what we use at my tables.

Maybe something designed for one of my games
will be useful and fun for someone out there.

Any recommendations on getting feedback for ongoing projects?

Last 4649matt's post:Taking a shot at a custom class

You know - I can totally agree with this sentiment, primarily because most people don't want to ruffle feathers. I mean - you go out into the world, put your toe in the water and then hope that people take the (hopefully) positive intent that you meant instead of reacting with hostile acidic vitriol. And let's be fair - most people who create content do NOT want to be on the receiving end of hostility because of a controversial opinion or ruleset etc...

On the other hand - as you pointed out - good debate is missing a majority of the time because we tend to try and respect everyone's opinion - no matter how much we disagree with it.

I personally record a podcast that challenges those kind of expectations and precnceptions about geek culture, pop culture and just culture in general all the time and I'm constantly amazed at how much we hold back - consdiering the intent of the show is to actually challenge people's preconceptions. Now that said - it does a good job - but still has those problems from time to time and the entire SHOW is built around getting some of that great conflict. So who knows what the right answer is?

On that note though - I'd love to actually sit down and do a podast with you on this very topic sometime down the line. Check out my site - see if you're interested - we did a set of RPG podcasts: Loving Us Some Roleplaying Part One and Part Two that was a lot of fun as well as a bunch of other material. I hope to hear back from you - and I hope to hear your response - cause this really is an issue that seems to just stick in people's craw!

Last Shauncastic!'s post:Shauncastic 17: Thoughts From The Well

And just think, if enough 'producers' went through the labor of love to product high-quality, open source content, we'd have a gaming utopia where people wouldn't necessarily feel pressured to spend hundreds of dollars on books, figures, etc.

I'm slowly developing a homebrew campaign for my players. For a brief moment, I daydreamed about the possibility of getting it formally published when it was finished, but then I found out how tough it is to go down that route. I think I'll just post it for free. My players are enjoying it. If someone else enjoys it too, then the fruit of my labor is sweeter.

Last Sunyaku's post:DnD Product Delays

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